Red Sox fans who are Patriots fans

[Pumpsie Green]

With the Sox season only technically not over (its been over for months), the Bruins having been locked out, and the Celtics not yet started, the only viable pro sports team in New England for us to cheer for is the Patriots. While they are now 1-2 I think that they will still finish the season at least 11-5 and be Superbowl contenders. Why? Because their defense is young and fast; its much better than last year. By the end of the year that unit should have it all together. Hard to expect so many rookies to be stars immediately. The team is five points away from being 3-0.
By the way, did anyone watch that call that went against the Packers last night? Unbelievable. I have no love for the Packers, but they got robbed. These replacement refs are just horrible, even worse than the regular umpires in baseball. Uggh.

[Bear]

This sounds good to me.  I'll post in here.  And by-the-way, if enough "coaches" get fined, Goodell should start a retirment fund for the "Refs" taking a vacation.!!!!

[Murph63]

With the Sox season only technically not over (its been over for months), the Bruins having been locked out, and the Celtics not yet started, the only viable pro sports team in New England for us to cheer for is the Patriots. While they are now 1-2 I think that they will still finish the season at least 11-5 and be Superbowl contenders. Why? Because their defense is young and fast; its much better than last year. By the end of the year that unit should have it all together. Hard to expect so many rookies to be stars immediately. The team is five points away from being 3-0.
By the way, did anyone watch that call that went against the Packers last night? Unbelievable. I have no love for the Packers, but they got robbed. These replacement refs are just horrible, even worse than the regular umpires in baseball. Uggh.

We can only hope the defense improves as the season goes on.  Imo, this is the biggest reason why this team doesn't have more than 3 Super Bowls.  I like that they got faster.  I'm concerned about the offensive line.  Teams have been getting to Brady and at least making him throw before he wants to.  As he gets older, his ablility to buy more time with his feet is becoming less.  I look at Sunday's game as a must win for the pats.  It will get them even in the win column, but more importantly it gets them a win against a divisional team.

[Murph63]

This sounds good to me.  I'll post in here.  And by-the-way, if enough "coaches" get fined, Goodell should start a retirment fund for the "Refs" taking a vacation.!!!!

I heard one of biggest sticking points in the negotations are the refs pensions.  Supposedly, the refs have been getting a lifetime pension when they retire and they do not contribute to their pension during their time of employment with the nfl.  They are considered part time employees.  Supposedly, the owners want to change the pension system for the refs.

[Pumpsie Green]

This sounds good to me.  I'll post in here.  And by-the-way, if enough "coaches" get fined, Goodell should start a retirment fund for the "Refs" taking a vacation.!!!!

I heard one of biggest sticking points in the negotations are the refs pensions.  Supposedly, the refs have been getting a lifetime pension when they retire and they do not contribute to their pension during their time of employment with the nfl.  They are considered part time employees.  Supposedly, the owners want to change the pension system for the refs.

Pensions are a huge issue with employees nowadays. Lifetime pensions are a sweet deal if you can get it, especially if you don't have to contribute at all to them. They are very expensive to run, but the NFL makes so much money that it seems to me that reasonable pensions should be granted to the refs. I don't think they make that much anyway. Here is some information about the disagreement:

While the two sides remain divided on annual salaries, referee pensions remain “the major sticking point in the negotiations,” as the Post’s Mark Maske reported last week. Maske cited a source who said the referees’ pension proposal calls for an annual league contribution of $38,500 per official — a number the NFL has thus far refused to accept. The locked out officials are in favor of continuing the traditional pension plan already in place while the league wants to eliminate that plan and replace it with a 401(k) plan.

Its inconceivable that the league cannot afford this and that they are intent on this apparent take-away.

[Pumpsie Green]

Here is how much the NFL refs make:

from $42,295 to $67,671, not including playoff pay. For a 10-year official, the NFL's Refs salary is $104,000. a 20-year-man at top scale would receive $120,998. .

And according to one reference there are 45 NFL refs in a season. If they contribute $38500 per ref per season for the pension thats $1,732,500. No one can tell me that the NFL cannot afford that.

[Murph63]

Here is how much the NFL refs make:

from $42,295 to $67,671, not including playoff pay. For a 10-year official, the NFL's Refs salary is $104,000. a 20-year-man at top scale would receive $120,998. .

And according to one reference there are 45 NFL refs in a season. If they contribute $38500 per ref per season for the pension thats $1,732,500. No one can tell me that the NFL cannot afford that.

As you said, it's a "sweet deal" if you can get it.  They are not entiltled to it.  On this issue, I do not have a lot of empathy for the refs.  Let them contribute just like most of the work force.

[Pumpsie Green]

Here is how much the NFL refs make:

from $42,295 to $67,671, not including playoff pay. For a 10-year official, the NFL's Refs salary is $104,000. a 20-year-man at top scale would receive $120,998. .

And according to one reference there are 45 NFL refs in a season. If they contribute $38500 per ref per season for the pension thats $1,732,500. No one can tell me that the NFL cannot afford that.

As you said, it's a "sweet deal" if you can get it.  They are not entiltled to it.  On this issue, I do not have a lot of empathy for the refs.  Let them contribute just like most of the work force.

Takeaways are a b!tch. Hopefully they can reach some sort of compromise because these replacement refs just aren't cutting it.

[Bear]

NFL releases statement on GB-Sea finish

The league has issued a statement in the wake of the wild finish of Monday night's contest between the Packers and Seahawks:
 
"In Monday’s game between the Green Bay Packers and Seattle Seahawks, Seattle faced a 4th-and-10 from the Green Bay 24 with eight seconds remaining in the game.
 
"Seattle quarterback Russell Wilson threw a pass into the end zone.  Several players, including Seattle wide receiver Golden Tate and Green Bay safety M.D. Jennings, jumped into the air in an attempt to catch the ball.
 
"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground.  This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game.  It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay.
 
"When the players hit the ground in the end zone, the officials determined that both Tate and Jennings had possession of the ball.  Under the rule for simultaneous catch, the ball belongs to Tate, the offensive player.  The result of the play was a touchdown.
 
"Replay Official Howard Slavin stopped the game for an instant replay review.  The aspects of the play that were reviewable included if the ball hit the ground and who had possession of the ball.  In the end zone, a ruling of a simultaneous catch is reviewable.  That is not the case in the field of play, only in the end zone.
 
"Referee Wayne Elliott determined that no indisputable visual evidence existed to overturn the call on the field, and as a result, the on-field ruling of touchdown stood.  The NFL Officiating Department reviewed the video today and supports the decision not to overturn the on-field ruling following the instant replay review."
 
"The result of the game is final."

Christopher Price
WEEI

[Murph63]

NFL releases statement on GB-Sea finish

The league has issued a statement in the wake of the wild finish of Monday night's contest between the Packers and Seahawks:
 
"In Monday’s game between the Green Bay Packers and Seattle Seahawks, Seattle faced a 4th-and-10 from the Green Bay 24 with eight seconds remaining in the game.
 
"Seattle quarterback Russell Wilson threw a pass into the end zone.  Several players, including Seattle wide receiver Golden Tate and Green Bay safety M.D. Jennings, jumped into the air in an attempt to catch the ball.
 
"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground.  This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game.  It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay.
 
"When the players hit the ground in the end zone, the officials determined that both Tate and Jennings had possession of the ball.  Under the rule for simultaneous catch, the ball belongs to Tate, the offensive player.  The result of the play was a touchdown.
 
"Replay Official Howard Slavin stopped the game for an instant replay review.  The aspects of the play that were reviewable included if the ball hit the ground and who had possession of the ball.  In the end zone, a ruling of a simultaneous catch is reviewable.  That is not the case in the field of play, only in the end zone.
 
"Referee Wayne Elliott determined that no indisputable visual evidence existed to overturn the call on the field, and as a result, the on-field ruling of touchdown stood.  The NFL Officiating Department reviewed the video today and supports the decision not to overturn the on-field ruling following the instant replay review."
 
"The result of the game is final."

Christopher Price
WEEI

In conclusion, the nfl still believes a 401k plan is not an unfair or unreasonable way to save for one's retirement.

[Muggah]

NFL releases statement on GB-Sea finish

The league has issued a statement in the wake of the wild finish of Monday night's contest between the Packers and Seahawks:
 
"In Monday’s game between the Green Bay Packers and Seattle Seahawks, Seattle faced a 4th-and-10 from the Green Bay 24 with eight seconds remaining in the game.
 
"Seattle quarterback Russell Wilson threw a pass into the end zone.  Several players, including Seattle wide receiver Golden Tate and Green Bay safety M.D. Jennings, jumped into the air in an attempt to catch the ball.
 
"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground.  This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game.  It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay.
 
"When the players hit the ground in the end zone, the officials determined that both Tate and Jennings had possession of the ball.  Under the rule for simultaneous catch, the ball belongs to Tate, the offensive player.  The result of the play was a touchdown.
 
"Replay Official Howard Slavin stopped the game for an instant replay review.  The aspects of the play that were reviewable included if the ball hit the ground and who had possession of the ball.  In the end zone, a ruling of a simultaneous catch is reviewable.  That is not the case in the field of play, only in the end zone.
 
"Referee Wayne Elliott determined that no indisputable visual evidence existed to overturn the call on the field, and as a result, the on-field ruling of touchdown stood.  The NFL Officiating Department reviewed the video today and supports the decision not to overturn the on-field ruling following the instant replay review."
 
"The result of the game is final."

Christopher Price
WEEI

In conclusion, the nfl still believes a 401k plan is not an unfair or unreasonable way to save for one's retirement.

As a consumer, the only real power I hold is to not continue to support their product if I feel it's inferior. I'm just about there with this.

[SeaBeachFred]

Doubtful I will post on this thread at all since I am most definitely NOT a Patriots fan any more than I am a Bruins fan and most most definitely not a damn Celtics fans either.  This is your baby guys and gals.  My Boston loyalty starts and stops with the Red Sox.  For the record I am a Anaheim Ducks fan in hockey, an LA Lakers fan in basketball and in football I  go back and  forth  between the Oakland Raiders and Miami Dolphins.  Still can't pick one over the other on that one.  Well right now they both kind of stink.

[Murph63]

NFL releases statement on GB-Sea finish

The league has issued a statement in the wake of the wild finish of Monday night's contest between the Packers and Seahawks:
 
"In Monday’s game between the Green Bay Packers and Seattle Seahawks, Seattle faced a 4th-and-10 from the Green Bay 24 with eight seconds remaining in the game.
 
"Seattle quarterback Russell Wilson threw a pass into the end zone.  Several players, including Seattle wide receiver Golden Tate and Green Bay safety M.D. Jennings, jumped into the air in an attempt to catch the ball.
 
"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground.  This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game.  It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay.
 
"When the players hit the ground in the end zone, the officials determined that both Tate and Jennings had possession of the ball.  Under the rule for simultaneous catch, the ball belongs to Tate, the offensive player.  The result of the play was a touchdown.
 
"Replay Official Howard Slavin stopped the game for an instant replay review.  The aspects of the play that were reviewable included if the ball hit the ground and who had possession of the ball.  In the end zone, a ruling of a simultaneous catch is reviewable.  That is not the case in the field of play, only in the end zone.
 
"Referee Wayne Elliott determined that no indisputable visual evidence existed to overturn the call on the field, and as a result, the on-field ruling of touchdown stood.  The NFL Officiating Department reviewed the video today and supports the decision not to overturn the on-field ruling following the instant replay review."
 
"The result of the game is final."

Christopher Price
WEEI

In conclusion, the nfl still believes a 401k plan is not an unfair or unreasonable way to save for one's retirement.

As a consumer, the only real power I hold is to not continue to support their product if I feel it's inferior. I'm just about there with this.

True.  I was listening to football talk on ESPN radio and they had a business analyst who works for espn.  He was saying full time employees of the nfl had their pension system restructured a couple of years ago and it's the same system the nfl wants installed for the refs.  The refs are part time nfl employees.  I believe the vast majority of football fans will continue to tune into the games and this will not hurt their profits. 

I heard Tom Brady came out publically today saying he can't blame the outcome of the pats games on the refs.  Imo, Brady has a great knack with the media just like Jeter.

[zenjak]

Patriots fan back from the days they had Sam "Bam" Cunningham and....that was about it. Remember them and the Baltimore Colts slugging it out to stay out of the AFC East cellar - a 4-10 season was usually enough.

I think the D will come along but I'm really gettting sick of these late 4th quarter defensive fades over the last couple of years. What they really need is a respectable running game. Until then, the O-Line will be doing nothing more than blocking pass rushes.

Refs:
401K type plans are the way everything is going now and refs aren't being singled out, as others have posted the retirement trestructuring for everyone else in the NFL. If the refs want a pension so badly, let the NFL pay X amount every year into the ref union's pension plan and make the ref union responsible for adminsitering it. if it runs out, too bad. then the refs may understyand why pension funds are no longer sustainable in the long term.

That said, the NFL should perhaps phase this in. Refs with over (let's just say 10 to toss in a number) 10 years or more keep their pension plan as is. Graduate that down to combinations of pension/401K for current refs and any new ones only get 401K.

[Murph63]

Patriots fan back from the days they had Sam "Bam" Cunningham and....that was about it. Remember them and the Baltimore Colts slugging it out to stay out of the AFC East cellar - a 4-10 season was usually enough.

I think the D will come along but I'm really gettting sick of these late 4th quarter defensive fades over the last couple of years. What they really need is a respectable running game. Until then, the O-Line will be doing nothing more than blocking pass rushes.

Refs:
401K type plans are the way everything is going now and refs aren't being singled out, as others have posted the retirement trestructuring for everyone else in the NFL. If the refs want a pension so badly, let the NFL pay X amount every year into the ref union's pension plan and make the ref union responsible for adminsitering it. if it runs out, too bad. then the refs may understyand why pension funds are no longer sustainable in the long term.

That said, the NFL should perhaps phase this in. Refs with over (let's just say 10 to toss in a number) 10 years or more keep their pension plan as is. Graduate that down to combinations of pension/401K for current refs and any new ones only get 401K.

If the refs want a pension, why does the NFL have to pay x amount into the system?  Let the refs contribute X amount from their salaries.  I agree the pension system is becoming a dying breed, but some who have a pension system contribute a certain amount out of their salaries.  I have a pension system and my employer does not contribute or match my contribution.  I have no problem with it because I'm grateful that I will hopefully have a pension when a retire some day.  When I retire, there is a formula based on age, number of years of service and an average of the last several years of salary to determine how much I receive when I retire.  This formula has been modified several times when it's contract time to help keep the system going.  I'm sure it will continue to be modified before I retire.  Some day the pension system may be taken away.  As pump said, "takeaways" are tough.  If that happens, then a 401K plan will be just fine with me.  I would want the $ I had contributed into the pension put into the new fund. 

Managing the fund is a whole different animal in itself.  In state government, it's not uncommon that the state borrows from the pension fund.  Some of the problem has been the government has not paid back what was borrowed into the system and $ gets tight when more employees retire.  I agree that a compromise has to be made.  I like the idea of a ref with a certain amount of years in may continue with the present system and new employees will have to take the 401k.  However, the problem is if this wasn't provided for other nfl employees than it's going to be very difficult to make an exception for the refs.